From TheRegister: “Ross Anderson of Cambridge Uni has published a lengthy and informative paper, FAQ on Palladium, the Trusted Computing Platform Alliance, their relationship and their implications.”
TCPA/Palladium Frequently Asked Questions
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSAlert.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
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that it confirms my worst fears……not just about M$ whom I have absolutely dis-trusted since 1994/5 but also the state of the IT industry. I can’t conceive of a computing platform as constricted and as $$$ focussed as what is laid down in the agenda for Palladium and the ‘Trusted Computer Crap’ initiative that the industry is about to embark /or has already embarked upon.
What spring to mind at this juncture is how to effectively block or impede this legislation for the good of computing as a whole?
Yes! I see the potential……….but I also see the track record of Microsoft/Intel (and others) and their insatiable desire to ‘own’ the industry.
Where does Palladium leave OBOS, Linux, MacOS, and every other ‘free’ platform…….?
depressed!
To me it looks like:
Palladium is a Pandora’s Panacea.
Meaning to solve all your problems, by unleashing a nightmare.
I figured out why microsoft hates open source so much. There worried that someday open source will get so popular they will be forced to open source their code, then the whole programming community will see how badly writen their code is and laught at them forever is this sentence a run on ?
-Line72
ummm…if this passes I’m moving to Europe. Oh. Wait. I cant…the whole globalization thing. Shit….ok…I’ll run open os’s like FreeBSD,Linux, whatever…Crap…with level of paranoia approching those during the McCarthy era I’ll be labeled a terrorist by a government agency and throws in a Federal Pound Me In The Ass Prizon for the rest of my life. I’m really not into receiving anal so that’s pretty much out of the question.
Umm… Umm…What do you know… cornered
Bad Religion said it best (many many many years go)
“I don’t want to be a global citizen ’cause I like my nationality”. Amen to that.
I home everyone is prepared to be <insert large souless corporation name here>’s bitch.
I’ve said this before, and I’ll say it again – Democracy simply does not work. We need a revolution.
Have a good day.
From reading the article, it seems that you can turn off the TCPA chip, but then your non-TCPA apps will quit working. This leads me to believe that you can still run non-TCPA apps even with this chip, so I guess there would be a place for free software afterall?
As far as the chip goes, I guess it’ll go really well with those keyboards with the credit card swipes on them so that the zombies … er, I mean … consumers will have a better ‘experience’ with their computers.
“I hope everyone is prepared to be <insert large souless corporation name here>’s bitch.”
Well, the sad thing is that most people already are be <insert large souless corporation name here>’s bitch, so this chip will probably end up on the market without much of a fight.
It’s a ruse to tell people “Oh, yeah, you can turn it off if you want to.” It makes the pill easier to swallow today. Face the facts: most techies are idealistic and ingenuous. “You mean after I get that chip implanted deep in my skull, I can get it removed later?”
So tomorrow comes and you cannot buy a machine that doesn’t have a Fritz Unit as part of the CPU. There’s nothing to turn off as Fritz is always there watching your every move. All the keys are kept in on-chip Flash memory.
Wake up, it’s 1984. But with better technology.
Every day, computers make people easier to use.
(In-Formation magazine)
#m
The economic impact of not having a free, open, and usable PC will be enormous. It will effectively kill the entire technology industry.
There will be no economic recovery while this manic security-centric mindset runs the government.
With global warming, pollution, and over-population, it may not matter. The Earth’s temperature is set to rise around 10 degrees this century. Everything is changing so fast the only thing that makes sense is to build your defenses and stockpile weaponry. As always, “might makes right”. Power pays homage to no one.
#m
#m
But can it clean my underware? I would buy one if it could clean my underware. My underware really need cleaning, so If this chip could clean them, that would be great. If bill gates wanted to clean my underware I might buy one too. After reading about all these chips, I really need to have something clean my underware.
Darius – Unfortunately I must agree with you. Suggesions on how to prevent/aleviate this are more than welcome. I’m afraid that desparate times demand desparate measures.
Michael – 1984 is a Hitchcock (excuse the fuck out of me for the spelling) book. Right? I’ve been meaning to get that but been to enthraled in history lately.
climonkey – You know that I’m with you 100% on trolling the insignifican threads (ex: * related to Linux. M$ *, software adds^H^H^H^H^Hreviews), but this shit is significant. Us (the iteligencia – the aristocrats) must take strong action against things like this. Corporate jugernouts are relying on the masses rolling over (yawn, what ever. what time is NASCAR on today?). We MUST do something about this.
I have in the past been pretty good at talking to complete strangers [relating to FreeBSD. Don’t ask
], so I’m willing to take that responsibility. Gentlemen – we need to take action. NOW. My email is [email protected]. Drop me an email if you’d like to start a [tech] revolution.
L8R
Orwell wrote 1984 not Hitchcock (he was a film director: Psycho etc.)
“Drop me an email if you’d like to start a [tech] revolution.”
Your mail is bouncing
Diagnostic-code: smtp; 554 delivery error: dd This user doesn’t have a yahoo.com account ([email protected]) – mta446.mail.yahoo.com
I think its time to start writing letters to CEOs of Intel & AMD & the media. No pt with MS, (I’d rather beat head on wall) but Intel backed off before. Problem is they are not doing the chip, someone we never heard of is so they have deniability.
>>today. Face the facts: most techies are idealistic and >>ingenuous. “You mean after I get that chip
The ASIC guys who are working on this only represent <<<<0.01% of all ASIC guys, it is Walt, Fritz & Bill that are driving this crap, no normal engineer would want to work on a chip that potentially will do so much damage to the biz they work in & then get laid off. It only takes a few spooky minded engineers to create this, but spook is hip right now.
And the chip implants are already here, mostly for the good right now, cochlear ear implants, retinal implants, muscle stimulators, pace-makers, medicational? implants, but you can see where that can go. Some doctors are actually pushing for voluntary implanted id dog tags for people, start off with childrens protection then onto prison inmates, then the rest of us.
I forgot who said this but we all know it
1st they came for the Jews & I didn’t care because I wasn’t!
Then they came for the Gippsies, Gays, Communists etc etc
Then they came for me, since there was no one left to care.
Google again
The proper text for this by Pastor Niemoller as well as the revised Hacker,…. version is at
http://www.rkdn.org/u-r-next.htm
[quote] Its obvious application is to embed digital rights management (DRM) technology in the PC [/quote]
i don’t want any part of this crap in my computer, i would sooner do without computers completely before i buy or build one with this crap imbedded in the hardware…
We have just witness an industry much bigger than the entertainment industry bowing down to them.
Anyway, thankfully I’m using Linux. All of my software except Opera is open source. So, I’d just turn this TCPA thing off.
[quote] Its obvious application is to embed digital rights management (DRM) technology in the PC [/quote]
It’s a poor thing OS News doesn’t support [quote][/quote].
This Palladium and TCPA is absolutelly nothing good for consumer. It is just a tool for big corporations and monopolies to get even more money and get bigger. I also think that it does nothing good to allow fair competition. I hope these attempts to take away our freedom dies ASAP. It should be banned by law.
I don’t think anyone in their right mind can deny that microsoft are attempting to destroy competition with this. But lets remember this: they are criminals. They are violaters of anti-trust laws, and therefore bringing something like this onto the market will be quite difficult. I dont see anyone actually wanting something like that, and since our microshit friends only care about money, they will soon realise this will be a major financial loss for them.
Take note: ms are currently losing market share with browsers, they’re losing against ps2 with x-box, linux has managed to find itself on oems, they’re about to get blown to pieces for an anti trust ruling, openoffice. And lastly, we’re all happy about this…
This is just an opinion:
As there will always be someone who doesnt want this, and there is always someone who wants to make money, the market for people who wont want this palladium crap will have to be satisfied… Perhaps this is a blessing in disguise for new desktop operating systems? I’m sure some smaller or bigger cpu manufacturers will still ship clean cpus, or maybe not discontinue older cpus. Lets not forget how intel tried to force people to buy rambus memory, it didnt take them long to adopt ddr after they realised they will make more money; even though it is at the cost of they only appealing technology that came with the p4!
what do you guys think?
You guys are all doom & gloom. This thing will not fly. Mark my words.
You all remeber DIVX not the current compression standard but the wonderful pay per play video CD’s. If you say DIVX these days no one remebers what it really was.
Pallidium will go this way because you will fight it. And not just you but everyone that doesn’t want to get ripped off. The same way DIVX flopped, TCPA will too. No one in their right mind will buy it. Sure lots of loons will but without the people in their right mind market they will not make enough sales to cover their costs, their stock will go down and you know the rest
Just because something is planned doesn’t mean it will a) be released as is or b) catch on.
If we as consumers choose NOT to buy these things, if we ignore Windows Longhorn, if we continue to buy new x86 hardware to run our existing Linux/BSD/BeOS/AtheOS/QNX OSes then manufacturers will continue to make the hardware. Unforunately, this revolution will be fought with money. Those of you squeezing Slackware on a P166, start saving…we’re going to need to you to invest in something worthwhile.
This probably not similar to the Rambus situation. Rambus also had a price differencial that the non technical masses didn’t want to swallow.
This thing is more spooky. It will target the non-technical masses probably at little (or no extra) cost.Plus, it has a lot of security-antiterrorism “sugar” on top of the pill(the masses do not act as a human, they act as an instinct” and the mass instinct gets tranqualized when hearing the buzzwords “safe and cozy”). Once the technology has been surgically implanted to this 80% we are all going down by momentum.
I agree that if everyone doesn’t buy Longhorn then TCPA could be made to disappear. But remember that the new M$ EULA will oblige lots of people to upgrade to it if they like it or not. Plus of course there are the OEM’s to deal with who will also be shipping Longhorn without question and unable to do anythin else. M$ has never really made big money out of the shrink wrapped software sales that we can affect anyway.
Time to colonise Mars?
Apple is using Motorola chips plus they have their own OS. I am wondering how are they going to be affected by all this.
Is this now a good time to move to the Mac??
Uhm… very true, except that BR’s lyrics goes: “i don’t need to be a global citizen, 'cause i’m blessed by nationality”. A slight but very important difference.
Nitpick??? Moi?
Remember Macs are the darling Media OS, I mean they got iX, iY, Iz etc. Well its the media people (the ones who traditionaly love Macs) Hollywood & Walt Disney and cronies that are sponsoring the Fritz chip co of Sen Hollings. If Fritz gets his way, all PCs will get his dumb down chip. Remember the V chip, the one that added $5 to every TV in recent production that most people forgot. It happened before because people couldn’t come out & say they wanted unlimited sex & violence on TV, yet since the V chip was forced, you could say there is far more of it today so the V chip proved utterly irrelevant.
I was also thinking that TCPA could mean
“The Communist Party of America”, then I remembered that Intels long time CEO Andy Grove escaped from Hungary in 56 IIRC when the Russians reinvaded Hungary. I wouldn’t mind having a chat with him now about freedom of choice.
…as I see it,its something like this…If I can steal it without getting caught I will steal it, if there are no consequences to my actions I will keep on doing what I have always done !
If people bought software instead of getting “copies, if people bought a cd instead of “ripping ” it, the industry would not need to do what it does!
They are doing what the have to do to protect what rightfully belongs to them. I am sick, SICK of whiners that go on about their personal freedoms but are more than willing to infringe on the right of others ( yes even “evil” corporations ) and steal what does not belong to them..
Why is it that these individuals do not go out and steal their food, their clothes…why? because there is a good chance that they will get caught and then punished! Why do they steal music, films, software? Because there is next to no chance to get caught!
( and for those of you who say Microsoft is evil and so I can steal from them…WRONG two wrongs do not make a right!!)
so …in all this who will suffer..well, as always it is the honest people who do…the poor sods that go out and spend their hard earned money to buy a cd or the most recent version of Photoshop, they will pay for the B******* that think that it is their Right to take whatever they can get for free…and that sadly enough is human nature!!!
so good..more camera, more survaillance,TCPA,untill we all live in a 1984 like nightmare of our own making!
Its really very sad!
Actually I think you’ll find that authoritarians only use “crime” (or the fear of crime) to justify their actions. While it’s true that if people didn’t do the things that authoritarians don’t like they might not have an excuse to do those things it doesn’t nesecerily mean that the best solution is to kiss authorities efat and not make trouble.
…as I see it,its something like this…If I can steal it without getting caught I will steal it, if there are no consequences to my actions I will keep on doing what I have always done !
O .. I see those big media CEOs, they couldn’t quite make it to get an Aston Martin this year, instead the had to make do with a meagre Mercedes. CRAPS !
And all that because a group of citizens are nauty.
Solution? Steal back. Steal a chanck of each person’s freedoms in the entire Universe.
This is some bratty logic. Nice !
As a matter of fact we could apply this type of reasoning in other everyday things as a panacea. Next time there is a theft in town and the police can’t find who did it, lets put the whole town in prison.
Ooo..oo.. beware if there is an unsolved homicide in town… the whole town goes on death row ! (those poor people ts..ts..ts. Well, its unfortunate but it has to be done and they shouldn’t be whinning)
People like you crack me up.
My software is paid for and the few CDs that I have are paid for too. No s?n ?? ? b???ch is going to do wide range colonoscopy on our expence.
…as I see it,its something like this…If I can steal it without getting caught I will steal it, if there are no consequences to my actions I will keep on doing what I have always done !
I’m sorry that your personal resolve is in such a state of discord. I would appriciate it, however, if you didn’t stick that same sub-par level of moral fortitude on the rest of us.
If people bought software instead of getting “copies, if people bought a cd instead of “ripping ” it, the industry would not need to do what it does!
What’s wrong with ripping a CD? I only rip what I own and choose to do it for the sake of convenience. How does that hurt the industry?
They are doing what the have to do to protect what rightfully belongs to them.
No, they are after power and control. The truth is that there are copyright laws in place. If a company feels that someone is breaking the law regarding their product, they are free to prosecute under that law. It is very wrong to assume everyone is guilty and restrict freedoms in this way and citizens should fight with all their strength to shut such initiatives down.
I am sick, SICK of whiners that go on about their personal freedoms but are more than willing to infringe on the right of others ( yes even “evil” corporations ) and steal what does not belong to them..
And I am sick of bafoons who treat freedom so casually and make a mockery of the lives of those who died to bring us this freedom in doing so.
Why is it that these individuals do not go out and steal their food, their clothes…why? because there is a good chance that they will get caught and then punished! Why do they steal music, films, software? Because there is next to no chance to get caught!
There is a key difference here that demands attention. You cannot wear cloths for free and rarely is food distributed for free. However, you can listen to music for free on the radio and TV and you have the right to tape that broadcast and listen to it later. You can also go to a library and they will lend you music CDs, videos and DVDs for free.
So what exactly is the difference if you tape a broadcast and listen to it later (which is perfectly legal) or download an mp3? Most people that copy CDs don’t see a difference.
Most companies, and you too apparently, operate under the delusion tha if one million people are copying CDs, and you can stop them from doing it, that it will equate to one million new sales. Such is not the case.
People that really like a CD will buy it and those who only mildly like one or two songs will probably just listen to it on the radio or borrow it from a friend or library; or copy it. If you deny them the ability to copy it, then the other two options are still available and they still most likely will not buy the CD.
I don’t buy CDs anymore because the music industry seems hell bent on promoting one hit wonders (or bands suck and can’t think of more than one good song). I refuse to pay over $15.00 for one mildly catching song. Will adding all this garbage to my computer to make me fond of the music industry and cause me to start buying CDs again? Absolutely not.
( and for those of you who say Microsoft is evil and so I can steal from them…WRONG two wrongs do not make a right!!)
I for one hate Microsoft’s business practices and most of their products (I really like their mice though). So I use Linux and BSD. So why should I have to suffer my machine not working correctly because of some digital rights management hardware crap?
It’s like saying some people steal so were going to cut off everyone’s hands. It’s absolutely insane and evil.
so good..more camera, more survaillance,TCPA,untill we all live in a 1984 like nightmare of our own making!
Or perhaps it is not so much to do with people sharing CDs and more to do with greed.
Its really very sad!
I agree with you on this note.
“I don’t buy CDs anymore because the music industry seems hell bent on promoting one hit wonders (or bands suck and can’t
think of more than one good song). I refuse to pay over $15.00 for one mildly catching song. Will adding all this garbage to my
computer to make me fond of the music industry and cause me to start
buying CDs again? Absolutely not.
”
You’re not limited to buying what is currently being promoted. There
are thousands of excellent CDs out there from 75 years of recorded
music (and even some worth having from before electrical recording).
Get some now before they are all copy-protected.
If you accidentally buy a copy-protected CD, take it back to the shop.
We are being treated as livestock.
Here is another article about how Microsoft treats us “domestacated prosimian creatures”
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/25956.html
Let’s be clear about this: there is nothing wrong with making copies of music you already own for your own personal use. What is wrong is when you make copies for your friends who don’t own the cd, or when you download copyrighted mp3s of music you don’t own.
If you want the latest music from Celine Dion or [insert the newest hip artist/group here], then *buy* it. If you don’t want to contribute to the pockets of fatcat corporate music industry CEO’s, then don’t buy their big name artists. Thanks to the internet, there are even more small and independent music outlets available, and many musicians are making some of their music available for free, even.
On the other side of the coin, part of the problem with the music industry’s reaction is that they would interfere with personal use or fair use. That’s going too far. If you *do* buy Celine Dion’s latest album, for example, you can’t play it on your computer’s cd-rom drive, much less digitally extract it to your hard drive, without bypassing their copy-protection. Of course, it *is* possilble to bypass it, but it increases the inconvenience. Perhaps that could be a selling point for some musicians, though. “There is no copy-protection on this cd” stickered on the case.
Adolph.
They should rename it.
Activate ramble mode.
Please understand that the vast majority of people DO NOT steal things. Most people do not even WANT to steal things. Even Napster didn’t hurt the sales of CDs THAT much, if at all. Napster didn’t catch on because people wanted to steal, Napster caught on because it was EASY, AFFORDABLE, AND CONVENIENT (though broadband users enjoyed it much more). The same reason is why people DON’T just copy videos and DVDs. It’s inconvenient (for now). They’d rather pop on over to Blockbuster and rent it for $3.
WHY IS THIS NECESSARY? Why don’t they just make music, software, etc… more easy convenient and affordable? The corporations will lose money in the short term, but will eventually get more because people will buy more. I mean, I understand making theft less convenient, but eliminating Fair Use? It won’t save us from the icky terrorists, because there are smart terrorists out there. They will just use older equipment and take their time. The paper already says that it won’t stop most viruses. And how, please tell me, HOW are they going to stop the mod chip/counterfeiting industry? Put FBI agents at every silicon fab on earth to make sure every chip has its little Fritzie? Or would the TCPA start assembling an army of “private compliance agents”?
But enough of my X-Files/1984/Brave New World/Snow Crash speculation. This may not get carried too far. Remember why I said Napster caught on? Well here’s some real reasons Palladium IN ITS CURRENT FORM AT THIS TIME might not go to those extremes:
Invonvenience: The TCPA will somehow have to have people always connected to a network for constant remote monitoring. That kills convenience. Broadband won’t change that because people can still turn their computers OFF and unplug it from the ethernet port.
Difficulty: You mean EVERY time I significantly change or upgrade, I have to re-register? Even for my appliances? Tthe National ID card might eliminate this problem–but what if your Nat’l ID is stolen or lost? uh-oh….
Unaffordable: um, yeah, easy anti-competitive options combined with making theft nearly impossible means companies can charge WHATEVER THE HELL THEY WANT for my stuff. All that’s necessary is for a “rumor” to get spread that Company X is going to use the Palladium chip to jack up prices and the paranoid instinct of the masses will kick in and STRIKE PALLADIUM DOWN. They may not understand delicate issues of freedom and privacy, but they WILL UNDERSTAND THEIR WALLETS AND PURSES.
–JM
–wants a mod-chipped Palladium equipped piano. (The chip being there to prevent copyrighted music from being played on that piano).
..The National ID card might eliminate this problem–but what if your Nat’l ID is stolen or lost? uh-oh….
Well, you are jumping ahead now.
This argument is scheduled to appear much later.
At which point the public will have to be convinced that ID cards must be replaced with an ID nano-chips laproscopically implanted into the human body (you always carry it with you).
The same thing will happen then as it is happening now; some people will insist its a fantastic idea.
wait until a virus exploits this and then you will NEVER be able to remove it from the so-called secure space.
I just read the first 15 posts here, and I found they are all missing the point.
It is not Intel that’s the evil here. It is not even Microsoft. (Doh!)
The ones that really f*** up computing is the content industry. Yes, exactly, the MPAA and the RIAA and what there are more of these “associations”.
I mean, what is it that we are so upset about? DCMA, CSS, DRM… who are the ones that generate need for these technologies? The content industry.
I mean, yeah, sure, a product deserves to be payed for.
BUT: I have the goddamn *right* to listen my music from whatever device I desire! Hell, I don’t have a stereo with me on the train for listening to the music I *payed* for, so why can’t I use my PDA for that?
OK, so they want to limit the product by employing copy protection, thus increasing sales (they claim). Then, why don’t they lower the prices? This is not about consumer experience, it’s about maximising profit…
I have the goddamn *right* to store a movie for later viewing, and I have the goddamn *right* to skip the ads! (Just for the books, I am living in Germany. In the US, the MPAA is currently attempting to deny you that right.)
The whole stuff about serial numbers, “personalized services”, TCPA/Paladium etc. etc. does only work because the content industry supports, no, *demands* it. No sane soul would fall for such a Microsoft/Intel plot if the content industry would not push it.
And US government is happy that it’s *US* companies that hold the digital world in a stranglehold. If it were Taiwan companies, I am sure the Navy would be already en route to “protect US interests”…
</sarcasm>