The updated 16-inch MacBook Pro features a larger display with slimmer bezels than the 15-inch MacBook Pro, which it has replaced in Apple’s notebook lineup. The display has a resolution of 3072×1920 pixels with up to 500 nits of brightness.
The notebook features an updated “Magic Keyboard” that does away with the unpopular butterfly mechanism, returning instead to a more reliable scissor mechanism with 1mm key travel, along with Intel’s latest 9th-generation processors with up to 8 cores. It also has up to 64GB of RAM and up to 8TB of SSD storage.
Above the keyboard, the Touch Bar lives on, but the 16-inch MacBook Pro marks the return of a physical Esc key. In line with the latest MacBook Air, the Touch ID sensor has also been separated from the Touch Bar.
It took them 4 years, but Apple finally remembered how to make a keyboard. Aside from the new MacBook Pro, Apple also announced the new Mac Pro will be available in December.
Firstly, I generally love Apple hardware, and the new devices have terrific specs, there are some nice fixes and updates for both devices.
I’d certainly purchase one of the new MacBook Pro 16″ before I purchased the new Mac Pro, maybe not the base model, ……. but I’m not going back to MacOS.
As discussed in other threads the problem isn’t the specs or performance of the new device, it’s the last half decade of Apple neglect. Most of the major vendors of the software I need to use no longer offer serious updates or support the MacOS versions, which have become a poor subset of the mainstream maintained versions. Add to that I no longer trust Apple to keep up the support for this hardware, their efforts seem at best “selective”, at worst “optional”.
Perhaps if Apple pay the vendors to get back in the MacOS version of the business there remains some hope, or perhaps a future version of MacOS offers some undeniable new advantage for workflows and processing. But otherwise it seems at least one of those two announcements is a wasted effort, if not both! Even some of the people reviewing the devices cannot identify who they are targeted for, some even admit that these updates are of not for them despite being otherwise positive about the hardware. For me it’s a bit sad.
I completely agree with cpcf, I won’t be going back to Apple Mac OS X based hardware or anything Apple for that matter. My Mac Pro 2006 was upgraded to Windows 7 64-bit in the past since I found it easier to put Windows 7 64-bit on the system rather then upgrade to the latest Mac OS X 64-bit OS (issue with 32-bit EFI, which Windows doesn’t seem to have an issue with). My Macbook Pro 2012 was upgraded to Windows 10 after Mac OS X kept randomly shutting off/on my secondary 30″ monitor. I took it into the Apple Store multiple times, one of which they replaced the logic board. I even tried submitting it as a Mac OS X bug since I thought maybe it was a video driver issue. I put Windows 7/10 on the system and the issue went away. It amazes me that Apple has a limited amount of hardware they have to support and they can’t even get that right.
Since then I decided I am done with Apple products and even replaced my old Apple TV with a Fire TV which was cheaper and allowed me to side load stuff easier. As cpcf mentioned the last half decade has been Apple neglect when it comes to anything besides the iPhone, and even then iOS has recently had some major issues in the latest releases from what I read. I cannot recommend Mac OS X based products anymore due to this neglect and overall in my experience Windows 10 just performs better overall. Heck if you don’t like Windows I am sure Linux would be a much better choice then Mac OS X since now in days since as cpcf explained most of the developers have stopped supporting their software, or updates are much less frequent on Mac OS X to say it has more software support.
I started on Mac OS X because it was better then Windows XP at the time. Windows 7 brought Windows closer to Mac OS X but I thought the multi-tasking was not as good as Mac OS X. Currently my new main desktop is an Intel NUC 8 (I prefer mini systems) running Windows 10 and I couldn’t be more happy, it runs amazing and I have zero issues. All my 32-bit software works great (Catalina dumps that), OpenGL and even Vulkan based stuff works (OpenGL is being deprecated and Vulkan is not supported). Really the only reason to get a Mac OS X based product is if you own a iPhone and/or iPad and want it to fully integrate with the desktop OS. If you don’t have a iPhone or iPad, why even deal with the Apple neglect of Mac OS X. You would be crazy to pay the Apple price premium to own only a Apple desktop and none of their other products. The ONLY reason to own a Mac desktop or laptop is because you want that extra integration it has with their other devices they sell.
Sounds like your experience is similar to mine, my biggest problems were related to drivers for graphics cards and OS updates or the lack of OS updates. Software vendors would keep up to date but MacOS wouldn’t, leaving me in no-mans land, not able to upgrade software yet needing the newer features. So it was a no-brainer, first I went to Windows 8.1 Pro then the free upgrade to Windows 10 Pro, I’m not going back to MacOS.
Linux is an interesting one, while not fully supported several of the vendors I need are in the early stages of making ports available. So I’ve a couple of Mac Pros running Linux now and working perfectly as Linux workstations while running some of the software I need in beta.
I still have one Mac Pro and one iMac running MacOS for compatibility purposes, but our need to use then diminishes year after year and soon they’ll be redundant.
For my personal devices I use Win 10 Pro with the iPhone X and have no problems with integration. Although the latest iPhone updates are a bit flaky, something I’m not use to seeing from Apple on the phone side of things, perhaps the Mac attitude is contagious!
Things aren’t much better as far as software support on the Windows side of things. My real question about this new hardware is whether its serviceable. I don’t be buying computers I can’t service any more.
After seeing that a Character Map program (yup, something that literally is used for finding characters not typable on the keyboard) in the App store wanted 9.99 USD, I still wonder why people like Apple products. Interesting desigb for sure, but the same software elsewhere is almost always free, or at a much cheaper price than it is for Mac.
That seems like an odd reason to write-off an entire platform. Control-Command-Space brings up the Character Map.
How does the new MacBook Pro keyboard compare to, say, a ThinkPad X1 Carbon’s?
One ‘ESC’ key does not make a ‘working keyboard’.
The last ‘working keyboard’ can be found on ThinkPad 25 Anniversary Edition from 2017 … or ThinkPad T420/T520/W520/X220 from 2011.
Sounds like they did a lot of things right with this machine without making any sacrifices that they didn’t make before:
* Better keyboard…
* Better touchbarthingy…by making it less touchbar
* Bigger screen in same size body (hxw)
* Bigger battery in slightly thicker body (d)
* Better thermals
* Better charger
* Decision to just replace the current 15″ with this offering!
I am looking for a powerhouse laptop like this, but this one isn’t going to be it:
* Absolute dealbreakers
1. No touchscreen. I currently use a seperate private laptop with a touchscreen to test app-development and want to get rid of that. 2.5K laptops in 2019/2020 should have touchscreens
2. Not enough ports. I currently have a Dell Precision M4800 with build-in VGA, HDMI and DP and it is great that I can connect to external monitors at all my customers and workplaces. Even giving up just one of those sounds like a negative to me. Same for old fashioned USB ports, headphone-jack and SD-Card. I understand I can add a whole bunch of dongles or add a TB3-dockingstation that is not the goal of a portable machine*
Pretty much dealbreakers
1. No 4K internally. 2.5K laptops in 2019/2020 should have 4K. These laptops should last 5 years and not having 4K in a new machine is like not having Full HD in a current machine
2. No LTE/5G option. I would like to stay of the Wifi of some of my customers and instead just rely on my own internet connection. Because of battery concerns I would prefer to tether my phone to my laptop instead of the other way around
If anyone reading this has a suggestion for a machine that has a better balance between old-goodies (ports) and new-goodies (TB3, touchscreen, 4K, LTE) I would be very happy
Dealbreakers:
1) no 4k internally. 4K makes absolutely no sense at 16″. Having a 1536×960 HiDPI (from 3072×1920) is already more than my sight can see. A higher resolution would require 3x HiDPI and most applications would require updates.
2) Lack of LTE/5G. Wait for the ARM based laptops at the end of 2021. They will be based on the Apple A15X chips with integrated 5G modems. My problem with the lack of LTE/5G is the lack of WWANd integration in the drivers from ZTE/Huawei/Alcatel/etc. They all come with their proprietary shit instead of modeswitching to the natively supported MBIM.
Full HD at 14″ or 15″ already doesn’t give a lot of vertical space for programming. Programming on 16″ at 1536×960 HiDPI just doesn’t give enough lines of code. You do realise that scaling doesn’t have to be an exact multiple right? On a 16″ I would prefer something like 2560×1440 with a 1.5 scaling
ARM based laptops at the end of 2021? Might be interesting, but no idea how well that would work for ….well….real work ;). And we all know that ARM based laptops are normally thin-and-lights that aren’t known for their ports.
I agree on most of these points, but will specifically echo the ports issue. I replaced my beloved 2013 MBP with a Yoga 730 15″, and it has 2 USB, 1 USB-C, and an HDMI port. I FREQUENTLY use all those ports – at once! Getting rid of those ports is an absolute deal breaker. (This laptop also has a 4K touch screen, an nVidia dGPU, and cost less than half of a similar MBP – the only down side is Windows…)
The other thing I need in a laptop is that I can take it apart and upgrade various items, including the WiFi module (which I already did upgrade), the SSD, and the RAM. I will not ever buy a laptop I can’t upgrade and/or service. Especially not one that costs $3,000. The folks at Apple has lost their friggin’ minds.
If Apple could make this laptop serviceable, and offer a version without that stupid touchbar, I would at least be willing to check it out. Otherwise, it’s dead on arrival for me.
That Lenovo looks pretty good as a mixture between my worklaptop (Dell Precision M4800) and my private laptop (Lenovo Yoga 3.14) but also has a couple of deal breakers. Like you said: Ports, but also keyboard and battery and I would like the CPU to be beefier
Basically I want a version of the M4800 where 3 of the 5 USB ports become ThunderBolt 3 ports, the DVD/MediaBay can go away to make the machine a lot thinner and lighter, 2020 version of the CPU, slimmer bezels so a 16.5″ screen would fit in the same body and as I said: 4K Touchscreen. Almost forgot: Windows Hello Camera or FingerPrint Scanner! That would be a dream machine for me that I would gladly pay 2.5K for
I actually like Windows 10 and need it for work, but sometimes need a MAC (app-development) that I use “MacInCloud” for right now. Having a Mac with a touchscreen would be great
I’m sorry but it seems neither of you, or me for that matter, are the intended market for Apple’s laptops.
It’s like reading about how Mercedes released a new luxury sedan and wonder why they are not selling a pick up truck we can modify/repair instead, which is what we want.
Isn’t that the problem, the who….?
Most reviewers so far haven’t been able to identify the target audience, all it seems they can confirm is that they are not in it!
When I read the initial summaries I immediately thought specialist CAD workstation, but the problem is much of the specialist CAD Software is no longer available in an up to date package for MacOS!
So who does that leave, Hollywood video editor, but they are already heavily invested in Windows and Linux as well. And also a lot of cloud hosted platforms, so if they need a Mac then an Air works perfectly for them!
No, I am definitely the target market for this device. I want a big screen on a powerful mobile machine to work on, need plenty of horsepower, don’t mind the price so much as I will quickly earn back that money and even have a usecase for MacOS although I would use Windows 95% of the time…yet the lack of ports and touchscreen make this machine a no-go for me
To be hones, I looked around a lot tonight and still haven’t found my dream machine. Several machines come close but it seems like all modern machines that have touch have dropped VGA and only supply either DP or HDMI while often offering just not enough USB Ports. The funniest one that I ran into was way too small, but shows that it is entirely possible to make a thin machine with a whole bunch of connectivity: https://liliputing.com/2019/08/vaio-sx12-now-available-in-the-us-smallest-laptop-with-a-vga-port.html
@cpcf: “Creatives” seem to be the target market for this device. Audio, Image and Video-editing is the thing that is shown in all the videos. Much of that work has shifted to Windows, but Apple might actually succeed in keeping the people they still have left and even get some creatives back
“Bigger screen in same size body”
“Better thermals”
Physics say you have to pick one or the other. Either a big and bulky model with the processor number ending in H that has proper heatsinks, or just accept a laptop that’s little more than a tablet internally for that precious thinness.
“No LTE/5G option.”
As long as the wireless carrier situation in the U.S. is still terrible for consumers and with incompatible networks, this isn’t something that will be built into the vast majority of laptops.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ceteris_paribus ;). You missed the part where I wrote (hxw). This machine is slightly thicker (d). Also, you assume that the previous generation was entirely optimised thermally. As far as I read so far this machine is indeed better at sustaining high speeds so they did something right here!
But we are not talking about consumers or the vast majority of laptops here. We are talking about 1 specific business work horse (also, I am not from the US and also this U.S. mess hasn’t stopped LTE in phones)