Ever wondered what Microsoft’s canceled version of Windows for the Surface Duo was going to be like? Well wonder no more, as we’ve got a first hands-on look at a pre-release build from mid-2018 running on a Lumia 950. We’ve already shown you what Andromeda OS looked like in recreated mockups, so now it’s time to see the real thing running on video.
The idea of using a blank canvas for writing as the homescreen is fascinating, but it’s definitely not the first time this has been tried. In fact, one sure way to ensure your mobile platform will fail, is to build it around the notepad interface. It didn’t work for PenPoint OS, it didn’t work for Apple’s Newton, and it didn’t work for any other attempts either.
People simply do not want to do handwriting on a computer. It’s been tried over and over, and people just don’t like it. The only platform which has been able to sort of make handwriting work is Palm OS, but that’s a misnomer since Palm’s Graffiti was a standardised character set you had to learn – it didn’t recognise handwriting at all.
Thom Holwerda,
It’s not everyone’s cup of tea, but believe it or not I still take handwritten notes on old-school paper for things like grocery lists and at meetings. I find using touch screen keyboards is just too tedious for input. Even when I need something on the phone I’ll type it on a desktop first and email it to myself so I can avoid the inefficiency of touch screen keyboards.
Hypothetically if I had a device that took hand written notes as well as paper it could replace paper for me. I’ve even tried buying generic capacitive pens for generic android phones but I came away very disappointed. They felt awful, like a blunt and rubbery feeling of an eraser instead of the crisp feeling of a pencil or smooth feeling of a pen. I imagine if I bought a high end phone or tablet designed for artistic work that would probably make a big difference, but I’m too price sensitive to spend a lot of money for a phone.
I did find microsoft’s fold-able tablet ideas intriguing. While I don’t think pens can revolutionize mainstream phones, I do think there is appeal for a pen that is cheap and actually works well.
Have you tried an e-ink tablet? There are some interesting devices for note taking.
jgfenix,
I’ve never owned one, but I tried one of the original Barns and Noble NOOK e-ink devices. I hadn’t really thought about using a separate tablet for note taking, but that’s an idea and I would expect things to have gotten a lot better. Maybe there’s something that could work, but personally I take vendor locking very seriously. Not being able to get at my data or having to use a proprietary software/service are big concerns. I don’t really know enough about these to make good conclusions.
It would be nice to be able to take notes from the tablet and transfer them to other devices, like phone and computers so I wouldn’t have to take the tablet everywhere (like a grocery store). Ideally I’d be able to use scripts to synchronize it with project folders on the NAS so that the notes are available alongside other project documents.
It would be really cool if one could take notes directly onto projected documents in brainstorming meetings, but that’s probably a big ask, haha. Epson charges a fortune for digital whitescreen functionality and it’s not very portable.
I see they discontinued the Nooks, and it’s been replaced with Glowlight, which I’ve never heard of before.
https://www.engadget.com/2017-11-01-nook-glowlight-3-night-time-reading.html
It seems like amazon kindle is the main player in the space now. I cringe going down the route of DRM and device restrictions, but maybe jailbreaking would be an option.
https://epubor.com/how-to-jailbreak-kindle-paperwhite.html
In short though, I haven’t really researched this much, but you are right it could be interesting.
What about the PineNote?
https://www.pine64.org/pinenote/
jgfenix,
I winced a bit at the price tag being 4X more than the kindle, but I realize that’s how it is without scales of economy. On top of that amazon’s products could also be subsidized by ads and book purchases.
As far as the product itself goes, has anyone used one? It’s still a very early prototype. It’s like a much more capable version of the e-ink displays for arduinos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBEhod2wxvE
https://pine64.com/product/pinenote-developer-edition/
It could be pretty cool for DIY hacking, which you rightly picked up as being something I’m interested in. I think it would take a lot of work to build the software from scratch and I don’t know that I have the time to do that even though that can be lots of fun. Now that I think about it this would be an awesome interface for an electronic calendar! The price though…
In any case thanks for the link! I’ve bookmarked it and I’m curious to see where it goes.
I don’t know about others, but I love my Samsung Note phones. It’s probably the only reason I’m still on anything Android, and haven’t just ditched smart phones in general for a old flip phone.
leech,
I would miss having a GPS, browser, email when traveling, but on a day to day basis a flip phone could still cover my needs, haha.
But then again, I’ve seen people who spend all their time on their phones, even when they go out to restaurants and parties. It’s incredibly anti-social behavior. I don’t socialize much, but when I go out with others I try to make a point of giving them my attention, I think it’s the least you can do. But at some point in time it seems to have because socially acceptable to ignore the people you are with to concentrate on your phone.
https://images.theconversation.com/files/121431/original/image-20160505-13461-1cyzxy0.jpg
Alfman,
The idea that technology will lead people to ignore their surroundings has been around for a surprisingly long time. I’m sceptical as to how much of an issue it really is, but that might just reflect the circles in which I move. Anyway, I’ll leave you with this cartoon from a 1906 issue of Punch.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/7bi3r6dzq04bhop/punch%20-%201906%20-%20telegraph.jpg?dl=0
oskeladden,
That’s a funny cartoon that could have been written for us today
I guess we can debate whether it’s an issue or not. In just my lifetime the change in social behaviors is quite evident. In person interactions are getting replaced by technology. Some people are bothered by it, maybe other people like technology more than people. One might argue that online interactions are just as meaningful as personal ones.
After graduating from university, moving, marrying, and having kids, my social circles IRL have been lost and it’s gotten far harder to find people of common interests outside of university. I enjoyed going to a linux user group, which was an hour away, but that stopped after having kids. It’s easier to find common interests online. While you can find millions of peers online, IMHO it’s easy to get lonely and disconnected if that’s the extent of your social life.
What’s everyone else think about in person versus online socialization?
Alfman,
I don’t mean that online socialisation is a substitute for in-person socialisation. Quite the contrary. I mean, rather, that I don’t think social media is eroding in-person socialisation. I teach at a university here in the UK, and it was stark just how strong an impact the lack of in-person social contact during the lockdown had on our students. I don’t think they see social media as a substitute at all, and in consequence I don’t read as much into their use of phones when with others.
oskeladden,
IMHO the social changes have been quite drastic, enough to get annoying when nearly everyone is paying a significant amount of attention to mobiles rather than those around them. It’s interesting that you don’t have this experience though, I wonder what other people experience and how much of this may be local cultures.
It seems that the university setting could be the best environment for finding relatable groups. It could just be me, but I’ve found it much harder to find friends I can relate to after leaving university. The social aspects of university was something I took for granted in hindsight and I miss it. We have friends of the family, but to be honest I don’t have much in common with them. Even work hasn’t been ideal because so much of IT is getting outsourced where team members including myself do our share of work at a distance.
The tech industry has long had a reputation for being somewhat antisocial. I think it’s kind of justified, but I’m curious what everyone else thinks about this.
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“People simply do not want to do handwriting on a computer. It’s been tried over and over, and people just don’t like it.”
I think we have just learnt to accept the inconvenience of app based mobile devices because of familiarity, despite them having genuine shortcomings in real life.
Consider the scenario: you have a minor car accident, and you want to take down the numberplate of the car that’s driven off.
You have to unlock your phone, search for / find an app to take notes in, wait for it to open, then open a new note, then write down the plate number. How many seconds have passed? Do you still remember the plate number by then?
Microsofts solution means I take the device out, take out the pen and write it down to deal with later when time isn’t a factor. No waiting.
@Adurb
On average probably.
Actually in the creative design circles even with engineering types more people use a stylus, tablet, handwriting than you would imagine. Handwriting apps like Notability and Evernote dominate, in particular there seems to be disproportionate representation of people with some form of dyslexia in this sector who find the operation of a keyboard a nightmare. A pen makes them many times more productive.
Tech company wanting to flog gear staffed by tech people wanting promotion or a pay cheque invent tech solution to whatever the marketing department can come up with.
No. Don’t need it. Don’t care for it. If I need paper and a pen I’ll sling them in my bag.
None of the “tech bros” have commented on the Z-80 OS yet. I thought it was “all about the tech”? No because that would be hard work and you couldn’t bikeshed like crazy. I’m not going to spend ten seconds looking into it. If there was a low cost or low effort useful system which had societal benefits maybe. Oh, wait. The “tech bros” aren’t talking about tech in this topic either but everything but the tech.
Personally I like a bit of analogue in my life and the less time I have to spend with a screen the better. We’re analogue and emotional and social beings. Surrounded by mechanistic systems is unhealthy. We come to bend and compromise to meet the needs of the system. We need the white noise, the rustle of trees, ergonomics and haptics. We need to look up from these devices and step away and remind ourselves of society.
I rarely carry a phone and even then only for emergencies. I have an A-Z if I need directions. I know how to use a pencil and pen and notebook. I rarely take pictures. I’m too busy being in the moment. That’s more me time. I also don’t need to waste x number of months of my life saving to buy some tech thing I will never use. It’s like putting 10 years on your effective life for free.
Tech rarely reflects ourselves. It is rarely an extension of us. It lacks the dents and scratches and scuffs of the analogue, the smells, the look of travel. It simply becomes more battered and broken. No matter how thin and light and shiny and full of feature creep and specification chasing it lacks poetry. There’s simply no romance there.
Holy smokes the UI is really that awful on Windows Phone? Looks like something a college kid did as a minors project.
Actually in the end I liked the live tile interface on the last versions of Windows phone, once I gave up the expectation for my phone to be a Blackberry, Android or IOS clone I found the tile interface to be far more functional.
I suspect it faltered in the marketplace primarily due to resistance to change more than any design flaw, after all as developers we are mostly lazy and only want to drive change when it suits us or makes our life easier. Also in general users are mostly lazy, only a very small percentage willingly learn something new and put off doing so until forced to.
> People simply do not want to do handwriting on a computer.
I’m sure some do but I would want it converetd to text. Unfortunatly for me even the best modern super computer would not be able to read my habndwriting. I cannot myself if I so back a week later. Such is.
> habndwriting
Typing skills better, but not great!
Carrot007,
That would be a nice value add, but even if it were just to save handwritten notes as is with no recognition it can be useful for replacing paper. Also there are a lot of times when you want to sketch a quick diagram in “whiteboard” fashion. If you have a sufficiently large touchscreen, then using a finger wouldn’t be bad, but on a phone finger accuracy is extremely poor and insufficient for fine details. It’s hard to beat a good stylus if you need precision, which is most of the time for me. It’s just hard to justify paying so much for stylus input.
Yeah, some of my posts could use more proofreading too. If I don’t pay attention sometimes the spell checker replaces words with completely different words too.