By: Alfman
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440916">rastersoft</a>.
rastersoft,
<blockquote>Well, that’s why XCB was created: to make X11 asynchronous again. I used it and it’s not very difficult to use it and take advantage of it.</blockquote>
Yeah, at one point I wanted to convert everything to XCB but I found that if I wanted to use OpenGL/GLX, I still needed to have a Xlib context even if I was using XCB...
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/32756336/create-opengl-context-only-with-xcb
https://github.com/datenwolf/codesamples/blob/master/samples/OpenGL/x11xcb_opengl/x11xcb_opengl.c
It stinks, but that's the way it was built so sometimes you just have to hold your nose and look the other way, haha.
By: rastersoft
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440843">Alfman</a>.
Well, that's why XCB was created: to make X11 asynchronous again. I used it and it's not very difficult to use it and take advantage of it.
By: Hexadecima
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440811">nia_netbsd</a>.
For that, you have my complete sympathy. Though I suppose it's not surprising the open source world revolves around Linux-as-default assumptions; after all, that's why LinuxKPI exists, right?
By: Alfman
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440824">rastersoft</a>.
rastersoft,
<blockquote>And then created XLib, which made it synchronous again…</blockquote>
Haha, that's funny.
It's true that it can be difficult to use asynchronously. It gets worse given that many GUI toolkits assume they should control the whole event loop. Sometimes you want to or need to write your own event loop. Of course you can spin off different threads to run multiple event loops, but sometimes I find the added synchronization and complexity undesirable. What I've done with X clients is to monitor the socket for activity using my event loop and then pass events to the graphic library. Of course some GUI toolkits would have you use their primitives for everything, but I like to keep my application code independent from the GUI library. Oh the joys of software engineering :)
By: CaptainN-
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440834">BluenoseJake</a>.
That's better than pissed on hands. :-/
By: CaptainN-
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440787">Titanius Anglesmith</a>.
nvidia has been holding back Linux for at least a decade with it's diver obstinance. It does seem to be changing lately though.
By: BluenoseJake
They will rip X11 forwarding from my cold, dead, pissed off hands
By: Shiunbird
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440823">kurkosdr</a>.
I am aware of that.
My point is the value of older software, not that sometimes technical limitations get on the way.
By: rastersoft
<i>I stole a fair amount of code from W, surrounded it with an asynchronous rather than a synchronous interface, and called it X.</i>
And then created XLib, which made it synchronous again...
By: kurkosdr
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440804">The123king</a>.
The removal of NTVDM was due to a hardware issue (x86-64 mode doesn't support Virtual 8086). Microsoft provided "XP mode" in some versions of Windows 7 to help users still relying on DOS (and 32-bit XP drivers) to transition, but the fact they discontinued "XP mode" in Windows 8 means that yes, they considered compatibility with DOS apps and 32-bit XP drivers not to be worth the hassle anymore.
By: Shiunbird
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440818">Antartica_</a>.
Well, look...
Working software that does what it is supposed to do and doesn't have any blatant security holes (or works offline) should still keep being used. Why waste all the development time and contribute to the planned obsolescence hellscape tech is nowadays?
How many times are we going to need to develop new email clients or new terminal clients?
By: Alfman
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440817">Titanius Anglesmith</a>.
Titanius Anglesmith,
<blockquote>That’s pretty much it. X will still be here for the many window managers that stick with it. I didn’t mean users should switch to Wayland, but I do think Wayland is getting mature enough that switching to Wayland makes more and more sense.
I always have the biggest issues with multi-monitor multi-DPI support on X On Wayland it just works...
</blockquote>
Exactly, it doesn't need to be any more complicated than this. Pragmatism at it's best without any of the judgement or drama. Anyways I'm happy it works for you and one of these days I'm sure I'll join you :)
By: Antartica_
IMHO Xorg being "deprecated" is no reason to discard X11 as if it were a dead platform.
Xwayland will be supported for quite some time, and now it is even possible to replicate the Xorg experience using a tiling wayland compositor with "xwayland rootfull mode" as its only opened app. So wayland can work as the driver layer for Xwayland, which provides the desktop.
In short: old working software have a bad habit of surviving [...says someone still maintaining some software for workstations using motif...]
By: Titanius Anglesmith
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440791">Alfman</a>.
> If X works for you, great! If wayland works for you, great!
That's pretty much it. X will still be here for the many window managers that stick with it. I didn't mean users should switch to Wayland, but I do think Wayland is getting mature enough that switching to Wayland makes more and more sense.
I always have the biggest issues with multi-monitor multi-DPI support on X On Wayland it just works. That was the reason for me to try out Wayland (I mostly use Sway and Wayfire) and it's been a breeze. I never had to look back because I was lucky enough that my hardware was supported.
By: Titanius Anglesmith
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440789">Hexadecima</a>.
Even Haiku uses Wayland to run Linux ports.
By: Alfman
In reply to <a href="https://www.osnews.com/story/140008/the-x-windowing-system-turns-40-today/#comment-10440805">The123king</a>.
The123king,
<blockquote>Classic chicken and egg problem. People won’t use a platform because of perceived “immaturity”, platform can’t mature because few people use it.
Funnily enough most <i>wayland</i> supporters do not claim this is the case, they claim that wayland has all the resources. If that is true then wayland shouldn't have a problem becoming mature, Then again I think wayland has focused too much on gnome and is playing catch up everywhere else, wayland deployment schedules need to factor this in because it is more mature for some than others.</blockquote>