“OpenBSD 4.1 has just been released. Federico Biancuzzi interviewed several developers to discuss some of the new features for networking, active porting efforts (landisk and UltraSPARC III), work on SMP, and the improvements in spam fighting.” More here.
OpenBSD 4.1: Puffy Strikes Again
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSAlert.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli
I am so impressed that OpenBSD is able to make such large and continuous improvements whilst delivering THE most secure and reliable system out there.
It just goes to show how important solid software development methodologies are – and more significantly, that they can happen in open-source-community environments.
On my side, I am so impressed to see a so small team deliver some so good pieces of software.
you wrote: I am so impressed to see a so small team deliver some so good pieces of software.
It speaks to the importance of having quality developers (as opposed to a team of 500 schmoes hacking away at nothing much).
The best programmers can be an order of magnitude more productive than the average ones…
Running openbsd 4.0 on my server here, i have to say the biggest plus is the simplicity. While other oses get more and more complex, OpenBSD tries to stay simple. That way there are no nasty surprises. Compare PF to iptables and you see what i mean.
The thing they should improve is the ports system, the flavor system is not really easy to use. and the packages should be build for all ports & flavors, it can’t be that hard.
The fixed release schedule is also a big plus. Having used debian before i really appreciate when to expect a new version.
It can’t be legally done. Many ports-only situations are around because of restrictions against the distribution of binaries, don’t talk about it until you’ve read the FAQ at least, Jesus.
Edited 2007-05-05 13:38
Ngrep is bsd licensed, yet it’s not available as package. forcing me to use the ports system. The postgresql version of dspam is also not available as package forcing me to do wierd flavor stuff (the mysql version is available though).
Maybe they are not in the package tree because of patent issues, but i highly doubt that. I have read the FAQ (before i installed OpenBSD even
), but it did not answer the case for the 2 packages stated above. And there is no need to involve Jesus into this.
There were licensing issues with ngrep in the past which prevented a package from being distributed. These issues
have been resolved with the -current ports tree and a package does exist there.
There IS a package for dspam supporting PostgreSQL. There have been packages built from 3.7 all the way up to -current. hrmmm. I wonder what this dspam-3.6.8p3-pgsql.tgz package is for.
You didn’t put much effort into that, that was pretty sad.
“Ngrep is bsd licensed, yet it’s not available as package”
ngrep package is available in current.
“The postgresql version of dspam is also not available as package”
dspam-pgsql is available as a package in 4.1.
I want to try OpenBSD since it’s the most secure BSD, but there are a couple problems:
1) Most of the packages are old/outdated.
2) There is no 3D acceleration from what I’ve read–not even open-source DRI/DRM?
3) The ports selection is very server centric. Very few desktop-oriented applications and games.
#3 is the biggest problem for me.
OpenBSD is made by professionals for professionals.
If you want to play cool games or enjoy accelerated screensavers please buy yourself PS3 or go and play with your favourite distro.
I do think the lack of WPA support in OpenBSD rather strange given the apparent ‘security’ focus which OpenBSD is ment to have.
I’m sure they would like you to pitch in to get it done
I do believe this is of minor importance to a server OS like OpenBSD, since ‘no one’ would connect a server to a wireless access point or the likes, but rather through switched and cabled 100/1000 Mbit gear…
The only case I can think of is the case of setting up a secure, wireless access point by letting OpenBSD act as a radius server at the same time, but in such case I’d rather use IPsec and OpenVPN and in such case I wouldn’t need WPA anyhow…
I think the OpenBSD team believe that WPA is an overly complex spec, and that you can get better and simpler security by running IPSec over your wireless link.
While I’m inclined to agree with them, I had trouble finding a wireless card that supported both 802.11a and hostap mode on OpenBSD. I also use an IPSec VPN for work, and never did figure out how to tunnel one IPSec session over another (though I guess I could have left that particular traffic unencrypted by my own network devices; my research on the topic was admittedly limited). I subsequently did find a wireless card that met my requirements at http://www.kd85.com, but by then I had punted and bought a standalone wireless router.
If you have OpenBSD on your laptop, you might also have trouble at your friend’s homes where they had Linksys routers set up for WPA only.
As has been commented before now, the OBSD team is relatively small. They have to prioritize their development efforts, and since this problem has a solution already, they aren’t expending developer effort on it. They have invited others to do it, though.
Edited 2007-05-06 18:11
What, professionals don’t like playing games?
I highly doubt that.
Maybe that’s why BSD is just a niche os with next to none users.
Keep up the superior attitude and you’ll be left behind in the dust not just by Microsoft (just ask Novel and Sun) but also by Linux which is getting more popular unlike BSD.
>Maybe that’s why BSD is just a niche os with next to none users.
No it’s a niche because of FUD and a huge lack of knowledge.
>but also by Linux which is getting more popular unlike BSD.
a) you do need massive hype
b) you do need some people without knowledge to follow the hype
Quality is superior and *BSD is alive and kicking since the 70s! Tell me about Linux in maybe 10-15 years. “Linux what? It’s Ubuntu merchandising …” :o)
Don’t know about FUD. Who is spreading FUD about BSD?
As for huge lack of knowledge, well, yes, if it’s so hard to use that only less than 1% of users can use it without gettin an advanced degree in computer science then you’re right.
No, doesn’t have to be massive, just a few people finding something good about it and spreading the word, like what happened with Ubuntu in recent years (note, I’m not an Ubuntu user)
And then you get some newbies willing to learn, in order to benefit, again, like with Ubuntu where you have total newbies actively participating on the Ubuntu forum and learning as they go along.
No, they will not become Unix admins any time soon but they just might break away from the Microsoft shackles.
And that by itself is a good thing.
Well, if things keep going the way they are then in 10-15 years BSD will still be confined to server rooms wheras Linux might be on 80%+ destops in addition to be the prevalent OS in server rooms.
Distro has to atract new users somehow.
And not providing downloadable ISO’s (correct me if I’m wrong here but I didn’t find any on their site) is a sure way to immediately turn away 99% potential new users willing to try it.
These days you only make money from an OS if you have a monopoly like Microsoft, everyone else has to give it away for free and make income from donations or from support contracts. Especially if you want to atract new users.
Edited 2007-05-06 20:32
“As for huge lack of knowledge, well, yes, if it’s so hard to use that only less than 1% of users can use it without gettin an advanced degree in computer science then you’re right.”
I know several guys maintaining OpenBSD servers. None of them has a degree in computer science. You do need some things in order to be able to install and use OpenBSD:
1. ability to read (instructions shown on screen)
2. ability to think logical
3. ability to ask for help at the right place (forum, mailing list etc.)
Furthermore, you need to be willing to do so. Don’t expect OpenBSD to install by itself.
In fact: Most graduated computer scientists I know (in Germany) are not even able to install a dumbed down Linux version.
“No, doesn’t have to be massive, just a few people finding something good about it and spreading the word, like what happened with Ubuntu in recent years (note, I’m not an Ubuntu user)
And then you get some newbies willing to learn, in order to benefit, again, like with Ubuntu where you have total newbies actively participating on the Ubuntu forum and learning as they go along.
No, they will not become Unix admins any time soon but they just might break away from the Microsoft shackles.
And that by itself is a good thing.”
I agree, but I’d like to comment: It’s always a question of what you want to do. Use the right tool for every task. Newbies usually don’t want to run a server that needs proper administration, they usually want a free platform for “everything” (writing text, playing games, listening to music, playing around in the web etc.). They can get this from most Linux distributions. They could get this from OpenBSD, too, but they need to know basics first.
“Well, if things keep going the way they are then in 10-15 years BSD will still be confined to server rooms wheras Linux might be on 80%+ destops in addition to be the prevalent OS in server rooms.”
We’ll see in 10 – 15 years. I’d like to say that I’m running FreeBSD on my desktops since 1998 now and I’m completely happy with it. Actually, I don’t see a need or a direction to change this. But that’s my very individual opinion.
“And not providing downloadable ISO’s (correct me if I’m wrong here but I didn’t find any on their site) is a sure way to immediately turn away 99% potential new users willing to try it.”
While OpenBSD does not offer a live system CD-ROM which would be the first choice for users to try some OS 8because they don’t need to install anything), OpenBSD offers to download floppy images from ftp://ftp.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/4.1/i386/ in order to start the installation.
For example, http://openbsd.sabotage.org/ has unofficial ISO images available for download. You should know that they’re not maintained by the OpenBSD developers theirselves.
“Well, if things keep going the way they are then in 10-15 years BSD will still be confined to server rooms wheras Linux might be on 80%+ destops in addition to be the prevalent OS in server rooms. ”
Ever considered that not every OS strives to be everymans’ desktop OS or dominate the server market?
Not everyone has the same goals and priorities.
“Don’t know about FUD. Who is spreading FUD about BSD?
As for huge lack of knowledge, well, yes, if it’s so hard to use that only less than 1% of users can use it without gettin an advanced degree in computer science then you’re right. ”
Doesnt sound like you even tried it… And yet you feel the need to talk about how hard it is. Still wanna know who’s spreading FUD..?
“No, doesn’t have to be massive, just a few people finding something good about it and spreading the word, like what happened with Ubuntu in recent years (note, I’m not an Ubuntu user)
And then you get some newbies willing to learn, in order to benefit, again, like with Ubuntu where you have total newbies actively participating on the Ubuntu forum and learning as they go along.
No, they will not become Unix admins any time soon but they just might break away from the Microsoft shackles.
And that by itself is a good thing. ”
Ubuntu surely gets more media attention then it’s worth imho. Hell you can hardly turn around with out the posting of a new ubuntu news here on the site. Try to submit a none linux in generel news and see if it gets posted.
“Well, if things keep going the way they are then in 10-15 years BSD will still be confined to server rooms wheras Linux might be on 80%+ destops in addition to be the prevalent OS in server rooms. ”
It might not be as wide spread but it’s surely not lacking in any area in comparison with neither linux or windows. It is funny how market share doesnt mean anything with comparing linux with windows but when it’s one of the bsd’s it matters.
“Distro has to atract new users somehow.
And not providing downloadable ISO’s (correct me if I’m wrong here but I didn’t find any on their site) is a sure way to immediately turn away 99% potential new users willing to try it.
These days you only make money from an OS if you have a monopoly like Microsoft, everyone else has to give it away for free and make income from donations or from support contracts. Especially if you want to atract new users. ”
I wont say i disagre although i did buy my fist openbsd cd set to try it out. Guess it all depends on who you want to attact as a userbase. Those who only want a free system or those who would be willing to give back. In either money wise or code wise.
“Keep up the superior attitude and you’ll be left behind in the dust not just by Microsoft (just ask Novel and Sun) but also by Linux which is getting more popular unlike BSD.”
I’m pretty happy using an OS that cares more about doing things right than being popular.
OK kiddo that’s it. You are instantly sucked by the great sucking wormhole.
WHOHOOOOOOOOPPPSSSSSS !!!!
Correction:
If you want to play cool games or enjoy accelerated screensavers or want to install without having to figure out the arcane partition system or onto more than 1% of PC hardware please go and play with your favourite distro.
“If you want to play cool games or enjoy accelerated screensavers or want to install without having to figure out the arcane partition system or onto more than 1% of PC hardware please go and play with your favourite distro.”
Arcane? You surely must be joking. The partitioning scheme on OpenBSD is about as straight forward as it gets. If one just takes a few minutes to read I do not see how there can be a problem. Linear and straight forward.
Arcane? You surely must be joking. The partitioning scheme on OpenBSD is about as straight forward as it gets. If one just takes a few minutes to read I do not see how there can be a problem. Linear and straight forward.
No, I’m not joking. Figuring out what cylinder it starts at? Having to count from the beginning of the disk? Please! This is 2007, not 1981.
“No, I’m not joking. Figuring out what cylinder it starts at? Having to count from the beginning of the disk? Please! This is 2007, not 1981.”
This has nothing to do with the partitioning scheme and everything to do with the application used for partitioning.
And no, you dont have to figure out what cylinders are used or do a lot of math. You specify partition sizes in (MG)bytes and that’s it.
This has nothing to do with the partitioning scheme and everything to do with the application used for partitioning.
OK, bad choice of words on my part.
And no, you dont have to figure out what cylinders are used or do a lot of math. You specify partition sizes in (MG)bytes and that’s it.
Then it must have changed since I’ve used it.
There are some ports that are audited too. It’s not that simple to download the source of the latest version of an application, compile and include into ports.
And no, there are a lot of bleeding edge packages.
1) This is complete and utter bullshit.
2) Correct. Until you submit your patches or someone steps up who is actually interested in hacking in this area then it won’t get done. Plain and simple.
3) This is ridiculous. There are plenty of applications used on so called “desktop” systems, audio software, video software, various desktop environments like KDE/GNOME/Xfce, e-mail apps, office suites, etc.
1) and 3)
http://ports.openbsd.nu/
Yes, instead of bleeding-edge packages you have old, stable programs, graphics not suited to a graphics workstation and no hip new games.
Weigh that against even one hostile intrusion to your system. (Which, in all fairness, could happen anyway.)
Chances are the glitz, high end capabilities and eye-candy/entertainment will follow and be safe enough to actually use. In the mean time if you have work that requires another OS, then that would be the one to use instead of the secure one. Just be sure to isolate it appropriately.
Cannot believe such a small team of OpenBSD developers made all those features so needed in any production grade environment.
Highly recommended for any environment that cares about quality, reliability and security.
Keep the good work on !!